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	<title>Comments on: Amended comments policy</title>
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	<link>http://www.hugoschwyzer.net/2007/01/23/amended-comments-policy/</link>
	<description>Author, Speaker, Professor, Shattering Gender Myths</description>
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		<title>By: Sociopathic Revelation</title>
		<link>http://www.hugoschwyzer.net/2007/01/23/amended-comments-policy/#comment-20715</link>
		<dc:creator>Sociopathic Revelation</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 27 Jan 2007 10:40:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hugoschwyzer.net/2007/01/23/amended-comments-policy/#comment-20715</guid>
		<description>&quot;I doubt the MRAs here think of themselves as mindlessly, reflexively forced to respond to Hugoâ€™s posts.&quot; --- Mythago

Yep.  

I rarely get a chance to post around this realm.  I made it quite clear that it&#039;s Hugo&#039;s blog he can do what he sees fit.   Cries of censorship won&#039;t change the fact that people freely posting on them are still visitors, regardless.  If I had an active blog, presently, I&#039;d have no qualms either doing the following: excluding anything irrelevant or characters that flood it with b.s., or . . .

 . . .  resort to allowing a separate area to confine more open ended comments that could be anything from personal attacks to tangents.  This would be in order to leave the more pertinent ideas and earnest-minded blog personalities to engage in argumentation without the foolishness.  The latter is a better plan that has been already implemented on several forums.   

At the same time, as others pointed out, baiting MRAs and then getting even more strident with regulations and policies isn&#039;t terribly conductive for any serious debate about issues discussed here, and will eventually stop luring lurkers if they aren&#039;t allowed to counter assumptions and premises declared about them.  I only started posting when Hugo quoted me, and continued to back off simply because 1) I don&#039;t usually have the time 2) I do have agendas that reach beyond this forum.  I admit I&#039;m somewhat interested in what goes on here, but I feel it would be greater served with the typical feminism versus anti-feminism camps (simply put, because not every case is so black and white) could really be put to the test now and again while staying generally on topic.  It&#039;s not usual when an area is able to contain such heated discourse without tempers flaring or people duking it out back and forth.  In the search for &quot;truth&quot; ugliness and anger aren&#039;t something that always goes away.  

But as The Chief pointed out, being restrained in a fight while an opponent is allowed to launch more aggressive attacks isn&#039;t merely poor sportsmanship, it&#039;s an imbalance that clearly is demonstrative of hypocrisy.  It would be like someone with a Tae Kwon Do, point-sparring background entering with a large, hardened contact fighter like myself in a cage fight---and not be allowed to use the majority skills AND power I&#039;ve acquired to nullify my assailant because of too many rules imposed on me . . . and the other guy can dance around as much as they want ***because the ref in charge said so.*** That TKD fighter may &quot;win&quot; with by scoring a quick point, but in a more reality-based context, my opponent is going to have a far, far more difficult time even if the arena isn&#039;t mine.

Eventually, if it does become an echo chamber over here, I have no problems with going toe to toe with someone who can openly challenge me on my semi-regular stomping grounds, and with me in particular if they don&#039;t like being ganged up on.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;I doubt the MRAs here think of themselves as mindlessly, reflexively forced to respond to Hugoâ€™s posts.&#8221; &#8212; Mythago</p>
<p>Yep.  </p>
<p>I rarely get a chance to post around this realm.  I made it quite clear that it&#8217;s Hugo&#8217;s blog he can do what he sees fit.   Cries of censorship won&#8217;t change the fact that people freely posting on them are still visitors, regardless.  If I had an active blog, presently, I&#8217;d have no qualms either doing the following: excluding anything irrelevant or characters that flood it with b.s., or . . .</p>
<p> . . .  resort to allowing a separate area to confine more open ended comments that could be anything from personal attacks to tangents.  This would be in order to leave the more pertinent ideas and earnest-minded blog personalities to engage in argumentation without the foolishness.  The latter is a better plan that has been already implemented on several forums.   </p>
<p>At the same time, as others pointed out, baiting MRAs and then getting even more strident with regulations and policies isn&#8217;t terribly conductive for any serious debate about issues discussed here, and will eventually stop luring lurkers if they aren&#8217;t allowed to counter assumptions and premises declared about them.  I only started posting when Hugo quoted me, and continued to back off simply because 1) I don&#8217;t usually have the time 2) I do have agendas that reach beyond this forum.  I admit I&#8217;m somewhat interested in what goes on here, but I feel it would be greater served with the typical feminism versus anti-feminism camps (simply put, because not every case is so black and white) could really be put to the test now and again while staying generally on topic.  It&#8217;s not usual when an area is able to contain such heated discourse without tempers flaring or people duking it out back and forth.  In the search for &#8220;truth&#8221; ugliness and anger aren&#8217;t something that always goes away.  </p>
<p>But as The Chief pointed out, being restrained in a fight while an opponent is allowed to launch more aggressive attacks isn&#8217;t merely poor sportsmanship, it&#8217;s an imbalance that clearly is demonstrative of hypocrisy.  It would be like someone with a Tae Kwon Do, point-sparring background entering with a large, hardened contact fighter like myself in a cage fight&#8212;and not be allowed to use the majority skills AND power I&#8217;ve acquired to nullify my assailant because of too many rules imposed on me . . . and the other guy can dance around as much as they want ***because the ref in charge said so.*** That TKD fighter may &#8220;win&#8221; with by scoring a quick point, but in a more reality-based context, my opponent is going to have a far, far more difficult time even if the arena isn&#8217;t mine.</p>
<p>Eventually, if it does become an echo chamber over here, I have no problems with going toe to toe with someone who can openly challenge me on my semi-regular stomping grounds, and with me in particular if they don&#8217;t like being ganged up on.</p>
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		<title>By: K</title>
		<link>http://www.hugoschwyzer.net/2007/01/23/amended-comments-policy/#comment-20714</link>
		<dc:creator>K</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Jan 2007 21:16:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hugoschwyzer.net/2007/01/23/amended-comments-policy/#comment-20714</guid>
		<description>Shutting down all typepad comments would also take care of the linkspammers that you get even on less popular posts.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Shutting down all typepad comments would also take care of the linkspammers that you get even on less popular posts.</p>
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		<title>By: Hugo Schwyzer</title>
		<link>http://www.hugoschwyzer.net/2007/01/23/amended-comments-policy/#comment-20713</link>
		<dc:creator>Hugo Schwyzer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Jan 2007 21:02:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hugoschwyzer.net/2007/01/23/amended-comments-policy/#comment-20713</guid>
		<description>K, I may do that with some of the more popular posts to drive them over here.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>K, I may do that with some of the more popular posts to drive them over here.</p>
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		<title>By: K</title>
		<link>http://www.hugoschwyzer.net/2007/01/23/amended-comments-policy/#comment-20712</link>
		<dc:creator>K</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Jan 2007 20:45:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hugoschwyzer.net/2007/01/23/amended-comments-policy/#comment-20712</guid>
		<description>On the subject of comments, how about getting your friend to close comments on your old typepad site to keep the converstation in one location?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>On the subject of comments, how about getting your friend to close comments on your old typepad site to keep the converstation in one location?</p>
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		<title>By: bmmg39</title>
		<link>http://www.hugoschwyzer.net/2007/01/23/amended-comments-policy/#comment-20711</link>
		<dc:creator>bmmg39</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Jan 2007 20:21:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hugoschwyzer.net/2007/01/23/amended-comments-policy/#comment-20711</guid>
		<description>Thank you, Hugo. If you&#039;ve made such sentiments clear in the past and I missed them, then I apologize for suggesting otherwise. (Remember, in the old system, there was a lengthy period when I couldn&#039;t post due to some sort of glitch.)

We&#039;re not always going to agree on every matter, gender-relations based or otherwise. No two people in the universe agree on EVERYTHING. But even while diametrically opposed on some matters, we should be able to find some common ground and make progress, rather that have two camps not speaking to each other.

bg</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you, Hugo. If you&#8217;ve made such sentiments clear in the past and I missed them, then I apologize for suggesting otherwise. (Remember, in the old system, there was a lengthy period when I couldn&#8217;t post due to some sort of glitch.)</p>
<p>We&#8217;re not always going to agree on every matter, gender-relations based or otherwise. No two people in the universe agree on EVERYTHING. But even while diametrically opposed on some matters, we should be able to find some common ground and make progress, rather that have two camps not speaking to each other.</p>
<p>bg</p>
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		<title>By: Hugo Schwyzer</title>
		<link>http://www.hugoschwyzer.net/2007/01/23/amended-comments-policy/#comment-20710</link>
		<dc:creator>Hugo Schwyzer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Jan 2007 19:47:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hugoschwyzer.net/2007/01/23/amended-comments-policy/#comment-20710</guid>
		<description>I do indeed acknowledge it, boy genteel; I have never classed you in the category of those who ought to be banned.  MRAs who are interested in talking about men&#039;s pain, for example, are welcome -- MRAs who insist on vilifying women as the primary source of that pain are not.  Male suffering is real; many MRAs identify the symptoms and completely mistake the cause.  As long as women are not blamed for male suffering, I&#039;m happy to hear interesting and thoughtful comments from responsible men&#039;s rights advocates.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I do indeed acknowledge it, boy genteel; I have never classed you in the category of those who ought to be banned.  MRAs who are interested in talking about men&#8217;s pain, for example, are welcome &#8212; MRAs who insist on vilifying women as the primary source of that pain are not.  Male suffering is real; many MRAs identify the symptoms and completely mistake the cause.  As long as women are not blamed for male suffering, I&#8217;m happy to hear interesting and thoughtful comments from responsible men&#8217;s rights advocates.</p>
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		<title>By: bmmg39</title>
		<link>http://www.hugoschwyzer.net/2007/01/23/amended-comments-policy/#comment-20709</link>
		<dc:creator>bmmg39</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Jan 2007 17:07:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hugoschwyzer.net/2007/01/23/amended-comments-policy/#comment-20709</guid>
		<description>Really, Hugo, I&#039;m disappointed that with the new year and all you haven&#039;t made more of a concerted effort not to pigeonhole people. I&#039;ve been posting here for two years now and think I&#039;ve been one of the MRAs with the olive branch. For those who are new here, I am a men&#039;s rights activist AND a women&#039;s rights activist, because I think the two causes are not only not antonymous but also in a way dependent on one another. 

The odd thing is: many female feminists on your blog have stated agreement with me or at the very least acknowledged a distinction between MRAs like me and those who do genuinely troll. One even invited me to be a poster on a blog she was going to start up. I knew she was a feminist and she knew I stuck up for men&#039;s rights, and she wanted me along anyway because she saw common ground. We wouldn&#039;t (and we don&#039;t) always agree, but we realize that it&#039;s not the end of the world if we don&#039;t.

And yet you (and some who are supporting your policy) consistently put all who support men&#039;s rights into the same box, so that if I end my post with the signature &quot;Men&#039;s Rights = Women&#039;s Rights = Human Rights&quot; I get lumped in with those who come on here calling all women &quot;bitches&quot; and &quot;accusing&quot; you of being gay.

I wouldn&#039;t lump most of the feminists here with the more famous ones who claim that &quot;all men are rapists&quot; or &quot;hating men is all well and good.&quot; So would you at least acknowledge that not all MRAs are alike?

boy genteel</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Really, Hugo, I&#8217;m disappointed that with the new year and all you haven&#8217;t made more of a concerted effort not to pigeonhole people. I&#8217;ve been posting here for two years now and think I&#8217;ve been one of the MRAs with the olive branch. For those who are new here, I am a men&#8217;s rights activist AND a women&#8217;s rights activist, because I think the two causes are not only not antonymous but also in a way dependent on one another. </p>
<p>The odd thing is: many female feminists on your blog have stated agreement with me or at the very least acknowledged a distinction between MRAs like me and those who do genuinely troll. One even invited me to be a poster on a blog she was going to start up. I knew she was a feminist and she knew I stuck up for men&#8217;s rights, and she wanted me along anyway because she saw common ground. We wouldn&#8217;t (and we don&#8217;t) always agree, but we realize that it&#8217;s not the end of the world if we don&#8217;t.</p>
<p>And yet you (and some who are supporting your policy) consistently put all who support men&#8217;s rights into the same box, so that if I end my post with the signature &#8220;Men&#8217;s Rights = Women&#8217;s Rights = Human Rights&#8221; I get lumped in with those who come on here calling all women &#8220;bitches&#8221; and &#8220;accusing&#8221; you of being gay.</p>
<p>I wouldn&#8217;t lump most of the feminists here with the more famous ones who claim that &#8220;all men are rapists&#8221; or &#8220;hating men is all well and good.&#8221; So would you at least acknowledge that not all MRAs are alike?</p>
<p>boy genteel</p>
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		<title>By: jeffliveshere</title>
		<link>http://www.hugoschwyzer.net/2007/01/23/amended-comments-policy/#comment-20708</link>
		<dc:creator>jeffliveshere</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Jan 2007 16:40:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hugoschwyzer.net/2007/01/23/amended-comments-policy/#comment-20708</guid>
		<description>&quot;Hugo, Iâ€™d like you to notice how many men on this thread are against your new policy&quot; --plunky

Not so many, really, which may lend credit to Hugo&#039;s decision.  It&#039;s really just a loudmouthed few that drive away good conversation (at times; not always).  These, not suprisingly, are the few that are so concerned about Hugo&#039;s numbers going down if they are no longer allowed to comment...

And, as the word gets out about the new comment policy, I predict more men and women who used to come here will come back.  But even if I&#039;m wrong there, Hugo doesn&#039;t seem to have changed the comments policy in order to strike a blow against men, plunky--it just happens that there are fewer men who are interested in feminism in a positive light than there are men who are interested in various flavors of anti-feminism, and they&#039;re vocal about it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Hugo, Iâ€™d like you to notice how many men on this thread are against your new policy&#8221; &#8211;plunky</p>
<p>Not so many, really, which may lend credit to Hugo&#8217;s decision.  It&#8217;s really just a loudmouthed few that drive away good conversation (at times; not always).  These, not suprisingly, are the few that are so concerned about Hugo&#8217;s numbers going down if they are no longer allowed to comment&#8230;</p>
<p>And, as the word gets out about the new comment policy, I predict more men and women who used to come here will come back.  But even if I&#8217;m wrong there, Hugo doesn&#8217;t seem to have changed the comments policy in order to strike a blow against men, plunky&#8211;it just happens that there are fewer men who are interested in feminism in a positive light than there are men who are interested in various flavors of anti-feminism, and they&#8217;re vocal about it.</p>
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		<title>By: Tom Head</title>
		<link>http://www.hugoschwyzer.net/2007/01/23/amended-comments-policy/#comment-20707</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom Head</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Jan 2007 09:57:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hugoschwyzer.net/2007/01/23/amended-comments-policy/#comment-20707</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t agree with Hugo on everything, and I&#039;m sure he&#039;s not exactly a regular on alt.fan.tom-head himself, but I support this policy 100%.  Do we allow &quot;civil&quot; white supremacists or homophobes to dominate a forum with views that denigrate many of the participants?  Better, I say, to put MRA posts in the same category.  It&#039;s not like they&#039;re going to run out of other forums to troll; they&#039;re everywhere.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t agree with Hugo on everything, and I&#8217;m sure he&#8217;s not exactly a regular on alt.fan.tom-head himself, but I support this policy 100%.  Do we allow &#8220;civil&#8221; white supremacists or homophobes to dominate a forum with views that denigrate many of the participants?  Better, I say, to put MRA posts in the same category.  It&#8217;s not like they&#8217;re going to run out of other forums to troll; they&#8217;re everywhere.</p>
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		<title>By: Andrew_From_Thailand</title>
		<link>http://www.hugoschwyzer.net/2007/01/23/amended-comments-policy/#comment-20706</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew_From_Thailand</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Jan 2007 02:44:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hugoschwyzer.net/2007/01/23/amended-comments-policy/#comment-20706</guid>
		<description>A word of warning : it really is best to leave this blog if you&#039;re posting anything remotely positive toward men&#039;s rights....I just had some of my comments removed in other threads that were totally on-topic, but I guess they were too MRA friendly.  Don&#039;t waste your time people - respect Hugo&#039;s decision and spend your time doing something more constructive in the real world or on other blogs.  Over and out.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A word of warning : it really is best to leave this blog if you&#8217;re posting anything remotely positive toward men&#8217;s rights&#8230;.I just had some of my comments removed in other threads that were totally on-topic, but I guess they were too MRA friendly.  Don&#8217;t waste your time people &#8211; respect Hugo&#8217;s decision and spend your time doing something more constructive in the real world or on other blogs.  Over and out.</p>
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